RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH?
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/6/2007 2:48:04 PM
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ZX1100F1
Posts: 2433
Joined: 8/1/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: NHSilverado
quote:
ORIGINAL: ZX1100F1
I wouldn't use Royal Purple or Redline as they are not GM4718M certified.
Pensoil Platinum Full Synthetic does though and is a good product.
I use Mobil 1
Where to start? Maybe here. The GM4718M oil standard is for GM vehicles that come with synthetic oil from the factory( Vette, GTO I believe, and maybe some others ). It would not apply to the Silverado 1500 in question. The oil standard that would apply to this person's truck is GM6094M and RP exceeds that standard. It does not list the standard on the bottle( RP doesn't do that except for one I will mention below )or web site due to a technicality of the oil rating system( SL vs SM - being certified for the new SM would actually cause RP to use inferior ingredients and their oil would not be as good - it does meet/exceed all performance spec's however so under the Magnuson-Moss act you are fine ). It is just technical red tape.
The GM6094M oil standard has to do with cold start properties. I have the standard spec's and what is required and RP exceeds the standard. It will NOT void warranty using it. GM states the oil must be API Certified( which it is )and meet GM6094M standards( which it exceeds ). So, he can use RP no problem and his warranty is fine.
On to the synthetic standard you brought up. Royal Purple actually not only meets the spec's for GM4178M it exceeds it from the info I have gathered. RP actually lists the 4718M standard on the bottle so any discussion about the subject is kind of pointless. It is right on the back of the bottle and I have seen it personally. For some reason they don't list it on their web site for me to proivide a link to however. But, it does meet/exceed the standard and is safe for warranty use in vehicles calling for it as well as his truck.
Redline is fine for the GM6094M standard and would exceed it( ANY synthetic would ). I don't know about it in regards to the GM4718M standard as they don't list that info on their site and I haven't researched the standard spec's to check it out the way I did RP and GM6094M( only oil I run and that was the standard I needed to verify - at the time though I saw 4718M on the bottle and as that is a superior rating I knew it would be fine for the lesser 6094M - just wanted the info for personal knowledge ). I do know it is very popular with the Vette guys required to use an oil that meets that standard however and many run it no problem.
Redline or Royal Purple are no problem in a Silverado 1500. The oil standard you site isn't relevant to this vehicle. NO offense meant by any of this but let's keep the info relevant to the guy's truck and what is required for it. No sense confusing the issue with standards that don't apply.
While GM Silverado engines call for spec GM4718M certified oil I personally would not use any oil that did not meet GM's more stringent GM6094M standard which (by the way) every oil that meets the later standard also meets GM4781M.
Royal Purple and Redline oils are NOT certified to any of GM's standards.
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/7/2007 5:43:54 AM
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NHSilverado
Posts: 68
Joined: 3/22/2007
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quote:
While GM Silverado engines call for spec GM4718M certified oil I personally would not use any oil that did not meet GM's more stringent GM6094M standard which (by the way) every oil that meets the later standard also meets GM4781M.
Royal Purple and Redline oils are NOT certified to any of GM's standards.
DUDE! You really need to educate yourself before posting.
#1 - GM6094M is the "CONVENTIONAL"oil standard for General Motors. GM4781M is the "SYNTHETIC" oil standard for General Motors. GM6094M is most definitely NOT the more stringent oil standard. Not even close. If the oil met GM4781M it would meet/exceed GM6094M not the other way around.
#2 - All new cars and trucks( that means Silverado )from I believe 04 on, that come factory fill with conventional oil, need to meet the 6094M standard NOT the 4781M "SYNTHETIC OIL STANDARD". Please get it straight and stop giving people bad info. GM4781M applies only to vehicles like the Corvette annd GTO that come factory fill with synthetic PERIOD!
Royal Purple EXCEEDS the GM6094M standard and is 100% safe for warranty use even if the standard is not listed on the bottle. All GM requires is that the oil "meet" GM6094M, be the proper weight( 5W-30 in this case )and be API certified( see the attachment below that is a scanned copy of my NBS 07 Silverado's owners manual - same info was in my 05 ). Royal Purple meets all 3 of those requirements and actually EXCEEDS the required oil standard. The Magnuson-Moss act allows you to use any mfg's product that meets or "EXCEEDS" the OE MFG's requirements and yor warranty is preserved. Royal Purple is 100% safe for use in ANY GM car or truck calling for the 6094M standard. OMG! Just to educate you so hopefully you finally get this straight in your head.
Also here is what the GM6094M standard is. It deals solely with the "maximum allowable low temperature pumping viscosity" of an oil. That is ALL! GM says in the manual to use an API certified oil that meets GM6094M spec's. That would be a minimum of ILSAC GF-3/API SL oil these days but also an oil that meets GM6094M cold temp spec's. An oil that meets ILSAC GF-3/API SL won't necessarily meet GM6094M spec's however. So, if GM6094M is not listed on the bottle or mfg's web site, you have to research how their oil performs in the low temperature pumping viscosity test that defines what the standard is all about. The new ILSAC GF-4/API SM oils will meet GM6094M as it has become part of that API rating now. GM does not specify any specific API certification level however just that it carry the starburst that signals API certification and "meet" GM6094M. RP does both and as stated numerous times it actually EXCEEDS the standard. In time, when ILSAC GF-3/API SL oil ratings become obsolete, I think you will see the GM6094M standard requirement vanish as the new oils will cover it.
GM6094M is actually an old GM spec( not sure if it was called 6094M back then but the oil performance stadard has been around with GM for a long time ) that they stopped using in the early 1990's when API started licensing oils and certifying them. GM dropped the standard and simply went with API certified for a while. As stated above the newest oil ratings( API SM & ILSAC GF-4 ) will include it specifically as part of that rating. Just a guess but I think requiring GM6094M specificallly has been brought back as a result of all the piston slap/cold start knock issues from the late 1990's to 03 +/-. The standard appeared in manuals again around 04 from the research on this subject I did.
Specifically the GM6094M standard is as follows( measurement units in "centipoise" = CP ):
0W oils = 30,000 CP @ -40 degrees C
5W oils = 40,000 CP @ -35 degrees C
10W oils = 50,000 CP @ -30 degrees C
As stated above these measurements are for the oil's "maximum allowable low temperature pumping viscosity". So that means any oil that tests out to that specific number meets the standard or exceeds the standard if it comes in with a lower number. Royal Purple's 5W-30 oil measures out at 34,800 CP @ -35 degrees C. So, it is well below the 40,000 CP maximum allowed. That means it EXCEEDS GM6094M and thus, by law, is perfectly safe to use and your warranty is safe. You can click on the link below, click packaging & properties above( sorry - flash based site and can't direct link right to the test info ), then scroll down approx half way on the page to see the test results( look for ASTM D4684 test results )...
http://www.royalpurple.com/prodsa/rpmoa.html
***NOTE - if you are interested in using an oil that does not list GM6094M on the bottle or mfg's web site look for the following test information( generally oil mfg's provide this info ) = ASTM D4684 . This is the low temperature pumping viscosity test info. You can find the test data and compare it to the info I give above. If it equals or comes in under the numbers shown then it meets/exceeds the standard and can be used and your warranty is 100% safe!***
Also, as I said in the 1st response on all this, Royal Purple also meets/exceeds GM4781M and it is listed on the back of the bottle( or it was last year when I researched all this ). This standard is superior to the 6094M not the other waya round as you seem to think.
No offense meant to you on this but you have me banging my head against the wall in frustration. Royal Purple is PERFECTLY SAFE to use in ANY GM car or truck. It meets and/or exceeds both of their current oil standards. Any service department that tells you otherwise only needs to be shown the test data and then they have NO right to tell you it can't be used by law. They would absolutely lose any court case. Doubt it would ever come to that.
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< Message edited by NHSilverado -- 7/7/2007 6:20:05 AM >
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/7/2007 7:55:44 AM
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ZX1100F1
Posts: 2433
Joined: 8/1/2006
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Do you even understand why there are the two (GM6094M and GM4718M) standards?
Do you think that the Corvette comes factory filled with Mobil 1 becasue it's engine is so much different than the one in a Silverado or that its nature of use is so much harsher on the engine then pulling a 10 or 12,000lb trailer over the hills in 100+ degree heat?
I have pasted GM's most recent list of all the oils that certified below:
You'll notice that every oil that meets GM4718M standard is also on the GM6094M standard.
Do I really have to spell out just what the hell that means?
GM6094M Registered Products*
Revision Date: 8-May-2007
Current ILSAC GF-4 Products
Product Name SAE Viscosity Grades ILSAC Grade
76 Firebird LD Motor Oil 10W-30 GF-4
76 High Performance Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
76 High Performance Motor Oil 10W-30 GF-4
76 Super Synthetic Blend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
AC Delco 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Agip 4-SYNT 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Agip Super 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Agip Super PC 5W-20 GF-4
Amalie Imperial Turbo Formula 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Amalie Xcel Super Turbo 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Brad Penn Superior Fuel Efficient 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Castrol Syntec 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Castrol Syntec Blend 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Chevron Supreme 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Chevron Supreme Synthetic 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
CITGO SUPERGARD 5W-30 GF-4
CITGO SUPERGARD Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Coastal 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Conoco Super All Season Synthetic Blend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Conoco Syncon High Performance Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Esso Extra 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Esso Uniflo 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Exxon Superflo 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Formula Shell 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Formula Shell Synthetic Blend 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
GM Goodwrench 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
GM Goodwrench High Mileage 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
GM Goodwrench Synthetic Blend 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Gulfpride Advanced Fuel Efficient 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
GulfTEC Synthetic Blend 10W-30 GF-4
Kendall GT-1 Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Kendall GT-1 High Performance Synthetic Blend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Lubriguard 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil 1 0W-30, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil 1 Truck & SUV 5W-30 GF-4
Mobil Clean 5000 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil Clean 7500 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil Clean High Mileage 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil DriveClean 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Northland MW Select 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Northland, Synergy Synthetic 5W-30 GF-4
Pennzoil Motor Oil 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Pennzoil Platinum Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Pennzoil SUV, Truck and Minivan Synthetic Blend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
PepBoys Proline 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada Arctic Synthetic 0W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada Maximum 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada Supreme 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada Synthetic Blend 5W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada XR4 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Petro-Canada XR4 Synthetic 0W-30, 5W-30 GF-4
Phillips 66 TropArtic Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Phillips 66 TropArtic Synthetic Blend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Phillips 66 TropArtic Turbo Motor Oil 10W-30 GF-4
Quaker State 4x4 & SUV Synthetic Blend 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Quaker State Advanced Engine Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Quaker State High-RPM Synthetic Blend 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Quaker State Peak Performance Motor Oil 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Rallye Turbo Approved 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Safety-Kleen America's Choice 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Safety-Kleen Performance Plus ZR 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Service Pro 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Texaco Havoline 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Texaco Havoline Synthetic 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Valvoline 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Valvoline DuraBlend 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Walmart Supertech 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Warren 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
GM4718M Registered Products
Revision Date: 2-May-2006
Current ILSAC GF-4 Products
Product Name Viscosity Grades ILSAC Grade
Chevron Supreme Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
CITGO SUPERGARD Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Mobil 1 0W-30, 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Northland, Synergy Synthetic 5W-30 GF-4
Pennzoil Platinum Full Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
Texaco Havoline Synthetic 5W-30, 10W-30 GF-4
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/7/2007 12:08:35 PM
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NHSilverado
Posts: 68
Joined: 3/22/2007
Status: offline
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You just don't get it. You are so confused and ill informed I don't even know where to start. Do YOU actually know why there are different oil standards for different vehicles? It doesn't seem like you do.
Towing has nothing to do with the GM6094M oil standard as that standard applies to all the engines using conventional oil from 4 cyl Aveo's to 6.0L HD Silverado's. As I have explained to you it deals strictly with the "flow" of the oil at a given cold temp( see chart in my last post for viscosity and temp ). It has no other significance. NONE! You can shout and holler and say the same thing 10 different ways trying to tell me I am wrong but bottom line is the standard has ONE test an oil must pass to meet it and that is flow at a set cold temp depending on what viscosity it is. Not sure what is causing you so much trouble with that?
Yes, the hi-perf 6.0L engine found in the Corvette is quite a bit different than the 4.3L's, 4.8L's, 5.3L's, and even the 6.0L's found in the Silverado's. You are talking a hi-perf specialty engine vs a traditional passenger car engine. Still all 6 or 8 cyls but totally different performance needs from the oil.
Here are a couple falsehoods you keep pushing. You really need to go and educate yourself on this if you are going to tell people what to do...
1 - You are telling people that the guy who started this thread needs to run GM4718M standard( it is 4718 not 4781 as I posted previously - sorry guess it was a dyslexic moment for me )oil in his Silverado = FALSE! Not even the 6.0L SS Silverado needs to meet this standard. The correct standard is GM6094M. I showed you the owner's manual page so you can continue to say otherwise but arguing something contrary to actual documented proof is kind of a waste of time. ONLY vehicles that come factory fill with synthetic/Mobil 1( ie; Vette, GTO, Cobalt 2.0L SS, etc... )need meet the GM4718M standard. ONLY those vehicles. If you want to say you "personally" only want to use an oil that meets that standard fine. Knock yourself out. But when you tell people that it must be used in Silverado's or that it is a lesser standard than 6094M you are doing them a big disservice and you look foolish.
2 - You keep telling people that the GM6094M oil standard is more severe than the GM4718M = false. The 4718M is a synthetic oil standard and therefore, in and of itself, means it is much more severe than a conventional oil standard. The standard originated for European hi-performance & luxury vehicles( BMW, Porsche, Jaguar, etc... )and deals with high temp oxidation of the oil over time. Unfortunately, I can not come up with the exact specifics as far as test data like I did with the 6094M. A base conventional oil that meets GM6094M would NOT be able to take the heat of a hi-perf engine that is pounded on all the time( GM has to assume they will be as that is what they are made for ). That is why a synthetic oil was chosen. A hi-perf engine definitely takes more abuse( ie; more heat and sustained high RPM runs ) than an engine in a truck that tows( hard on engine yes but not as hard as hi-perf use ).
Yes, I do understand why there are different standards and I know what they are. You clearly do not. I am just about ready to shell out the cash to buy a copy of the standard to show you but I have already done that with 6094M and you STILL don't get it.
That list is NOT all inclusive. That list is strictly for oils that specifically tested for the standard but it does not mean that any oil not on the list doesn't qualify. I also have seen that list many times( different dates )and they routinely have oils that meet it and are even certified not listed. Just a resource GM provides but by no means is it an all inclusive list. Also, as I have explained to you time and again, plus provided the statistical info to back up my point, an oil only needs to meet ANY standard or exceed it, not list it on the bottle, to qualify for warranty purposes under the Federal Law called the Magnuson-Moss act of 1974. Royal Purple exceeds the 6094M standard( + GM4718M is listed on the bottle if it makes you happy ), and is API certified. That is ALL that is required of you to fulfill your warranty obligations.
I am tired of fighting with you on this. Why don't you go out and either find the standards like I did, buy them, or call GM and ask( ask what the standard is - they will try and tell you only M1 or the list which is BS - and be sure and ask which oil standard applies to Silverado's - I can save you some time = GM6094M ). Maybe that way you will listen. Whether you want to believe it or not the 6094M standard is all that applies to the guy who originally started this thread asking about oil. 4718M is not relevant to this discussion. If it were Royal Purple would still meet it and lists it on the bottle( or it did last year when I first started researching all this ).
I am done with going over this with you. You believe what you want but please keep in mind you are telling people things that are NOT true and it does them a big disservice. I realize you thought they were true and that is cool. I wasn't born knowing everything and I certainly don't know everything now. I will go out and find the answers though when needed or it is pointed out that I am mistaken on something. You really need to do the same. On "THIS" issue you are completely backwards, upside down, and turned all around in circles.
< Message edited by NHSilverado -- 7/7/2007 12:12:22 PM >
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/9/2007 8:05:02 AM
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hunt4game29
Posts: 48
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline
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I use amsoil. And i love it in my truck and my grand am
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/9/2007 9:19:33 AM
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ZX1100F1
Posts: 2433
Joined: 8/1/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: NHSilverado
You just don't get it. You are so confused and ill informed I don't even know where to start. Do YOU actually know why there are different oil standards for different vehicles? It doesn't seem like you do.
Towing has nothing to do with the GM6094M oil standard as that standard applies to all the engines using conventional oil from 4 cyl Aveo's to 6.0L HD Silverado's. As I have explained to you it deals strictly with the "flow" of the oil at a given cold temp( see chart in my last post for viscosity and temp ). It has no other significance. NONE! You can shout and holler and say the same thing 10 different ways trying to tell me I am wrong but bottom line is the standard has ONE test an oil must pass to meet it and that is flow at a set cold temp depending on what viscosity it is. Not sure what is causing you so much trouble with that?
Yes, the hi-perf 6.0L engine found in the Corvette is quite a bit different than the 4.3L's, 4.8L's, 5.3L's, and even the 6.0L's found in the Silverado's. You are talking a hi-perf specialty engine vs a traditional passenger car engine. Still all 6 or 8 cyls but totally different performance needs from the oil.
Here are a couple falsehoods you keep pushing. You really need to go and educate yourself on this if you are going to tell people what to do...
1 - You are telling people that the guy who started this thread needs to run GM4718M standard( it is 4718 not 4781 as I posted previously - sorry guess it was a dyslexic moment for me )oil in his Silverado = FALSE! Not even the 6.0L SS Silverado needs to meet this standard. The correct standard is GM6094M. I showed you the owner's manual page so you can continue to say otherwise but arguing something contrary to actual documented proof is kind of a waste of time. ONLY vehicles that come factory fill with synthetic/Mobil 1( ie; Vette, GTO, Cobalt 2.0L SS, etc... )need meet the GM4718M standard. ONLY those vehicles. If you want to say you "personally" only want to use an oil that meets that standard fine. Knock yourself out. But when you tell people that it must be used in Silverado's or that it is a lesser standard than 6094M you are doing them a big disservice and you look foolish.
2 - You keep telling people that the GM6094M oil standard is more severe than the GM4718M = false. The 4718M is a synthetic oil standard and therefore, in and of itself, means it is much more severe than a conventional oil standard. The standard originated for European hi-performance & luxury vehicles( BMW, Porsche, Jaguar, etc... )and deals with high temp oxidation of the oil over time. Unfortunately, I can not come up with the exact specifics as far as test data like I did with the 6094M. A base conventional oil that meets GM6094M would NOT be able to take the heat of a hi-perf engine that is pounded on all the time( GM has to assume they will be as that is what they are made for ). That is why a synthetic oil was chosen. A hi-perf engine definitely takes more abuse( ie; more heat and sustained high RPM runs ) than an engine in a truck that tows( hard on engine yes but not as hard as hi-perf use ).
Yes, I do understand why there are different standards and I know what they are. You clearly do not. I am just about ready to shell out the cash to buy a copy of the standard to show you but I have already done that with 6094M and you STILL don't get it.
That list is NOT all inclusive. That list is strictly for oils that specifically tested for the standard but it does not mean that any oil not on the list doesn't qualify. I also have seen that list many times( different dates )and they routinely have oils that meet it and are even certified not listed. Just a resource GM provides but by no means is it an all inclusive list. Also, as I have explained to you time and again, plus provided the statistical info to back up my point, an oil only needs to meet ANY standard or exceed it, not list it on the bottle, to qualify for warranty purposes under the Federal Law called the Magnuson-Moss act of 1974. Royal Purple exceeds the 6094M standard( + GM4718M is listed on the bottle if it makes you happy ), and is API certified. That is ALL that is required of you to fulfill your warranty obligations.
I am tired of fighting with you on this. Why don't you go out and either find the standards like I did, buy them, or call GM and ask( ask what the standard is - they will try and tell you only M1 or the list which is BS - and be sure and ask which oil standard applies to Silverado's - I can save you some time = GM6094M ). Maybe that way you will listen. Whether you want to believe it or not the 6094M standard is all that applies to the guy who originally started this thread asking about oil. 4718M is not relevant to this discussion. If it were Royal Purple would still meet it and lists it on the bottle( or it did last year when I first started researching all this ).
I am done with going over this with you. You believe what you want but please keep in mind you are telling people things that are NOT true and it does them a big disservice. I realize you thought they were true and that is cool. I wasn't born knowing everything and I certainly don't know everything now. I will go out and find the answers though when needed or it is pointed out that I am mistaken on something. You really need to do the same. On "THIS" issue you are completely backwards, upside down, and turned all around in circles.
It has much to deal with then "flow" as you state.
You're an idiot and you don't read or comprehend what people have posted.
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RE: WHAT KIND OF OIL ARE YOU RUNNING WITH? - 7/11/2007 12:28:00 PM
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NHSilverado
Posts: 68
Joined: 3/22/2007
Status: offline
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Just to update for other people. Royal Purple still lists GM4718M on the back of the bottle. I wanted to be sure it still did so I stopped at a store today and checked. Still there.
Now on to the never ending argument  ...
ZX1100F1;
I don't know about you but I am tired of arguing and fighting over this. Really it is kind of lame the way the two of us have got so wound up over a stupid oil standard. No need for us to insult the other guy and call each other names.
quote:
You're an idiot and you don't read or comprehend what people have posted.
No reason this cant be discussed in a civil manner. I am just trying to help you realize you are mistaken and have things backwards. Not trying to be a jerk. Just trying to help you and others out. I am going to try and carry a civil discussion with you on this and try again to explain it. If you can stay civil as well I will stay with it. If not then what else can I do or say.
quote:
You'll notice that every oil that meets GM4718M standard is also on the GM6094M standard.
Do I really have to spell out just what the hell that means?
No, you don't have to spell it out for me and I did comprehend what you posted. You have no problem conveying what you feel is right. Unfortunately what you posted is not accurate and that is why I am trying to point out where you are mistaken.
It is actually very easy to explain why the oils on the 4718M list are also on the 6094M list. They are there based on what I have been saying all along. If an oil can pass 4718M then it should have no trouble passing 6094M because that standard( ie; 6094M )is a lesser performance oil standard dealing with cold temperature pumpability( from what I can find that is all - if more then it is insignificant and any oil could meet the spec - what matters is the cold temp flow ). If a synthetic oil can't pass that test it is a poor excuse for something called synthetic oil.
Now, using your logic about oils on both lists. If 4718M was the easier standard, and 6094M the harder one, why wouldn't all those 6094M oils be listed under 4718M? Think about it. IF 4718M was the easier standard it would have the longer list not 6094M. Please also note that ALL of the oils shown under 4718M are synthetics while the 6094M list has a mix of conventional and synthetics. Does that not tell you anything?
4718M is GM's synthetic oil standard and only applies to the performance & luxury vehicles that came factory fill such as the Vette, GTO, SS 2.0L Cobalt, some Cadillacs, etc.... It does not apply to conventional oil used in cars and trucks like the gentleman who started this thread is required to use in his Silverado. I showed you the page right out of the manual so not sure what more there I can do?
One of the major benefits to running synthetic oil is that it has a greater resistance to the thickening effect of extreme cold temperatures so at cold start it flows easier and quicker thus reducing wear. Would you at least concede that point? It is a well know benefit to synthetic oil and one of the primary reasons people use it. That is what 6094M deals with so a synthetic would be able to pass that test easier than a conventional.
The 4718M standard deals with high temp oxidation of the oil over time( sorry but I can't come up with exactly what the temp test is like I did for 6094M )and would be very difficult if not impossible for a conventional oil to pass. Not sure it even could because this is a "synthetic oil standard" so a conventional oil is out to start with. Synthetic oil can stand up to a much higher temp before breaking down than conventional oil can.
There is no real mystery as to why the synthetic oils on the 4718M list are also on 6094M but those conventional oils from 6094M are not listed under 4718M. Bottom line is they could not pass the test. Here is a great explanation of the heat issue from a web site discussing synthetic vs conventional oil...
"Because a synthetic oil's molecules are much more consistent in size and shape, they are better able to withstand extreme engine temperatures. By contrast, the unstable molecules in conventional oil can easily vaporize or oxidize in extreme heat"
Also, just to point out again, please do not take that list as the ONLY oils to meet those standards and that are okay to use. Those are just the ones who paid to be tested for it. There are oils out there that meet the standard or exceed it that are perfectly safe for warranty use. For instance Motorcraft brand( Ford )and MOPAR brand( Dodge )oils meet GM6094M standards but why would they pay to get tested for a GM oil standard? They are still perfectly safe and legal to use in your GM vehicle under warranty. The oil does not need to be listed on GM's list to meet/exceed the standard. Not sure if you realize that? Just those oils that the mfg paid to get tested for and listed.
I hope this more civil response comes across better and shows you where you have it backwards. No offense meant by any of it. I am just discussing this and trying to help you out.
Oh, and with a bit more digging it appears GM6094M 1st appeared in 1989 and went through 1996 when it was stopped being called for( they went to just API certitfied ). Looks like it came back in Dec 03( IMO due to all the cold start knocking and piston slap issues they ahd at the time ). At least the site that will sell you copies of the standards( $30 each which is why I have not bought them and posted to end this once and for all )has these years listed for the standard( 89-96 then 03+ ).
< Message edited by NHSilverado -- 7/11/2007 1:40:15 PM >
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You have got to be kidding me!?! 
